00;00;00;04 - 00;00;22;29 Tracy Kyttle Sometimes in education we focus so much on sort of like programs and initiatives that we almost forget that, that this is deeply human centered work, right? That relationships are drivers, that caring and supportive adults matter, that trust matters. And that might not necessarily be like the shiniest data point, but it's incredibly powerful. 00;00;23;02 - 00;00;32;04 Chuck Wallance From the Maryland State Department of Education, this is path makers stories of college, career and everything in between. 00;00;32;06 - 00;00;55;10 Brice Thomas Welcome to Path Makers. Same, same robust conversations, but a slightly different host. I'm Brice Thomas from the Division of College and Career Pathways, and I'm filling in for Chuck today. Surprise! Today we're discussing innovative approaches to building and scaling robust, career connected learning that includes modern work based learning and apprenticeships. We're also intentionally centering the learner voice. 00;00;55;13 - 00;01;15;14 Brice Thomas Joining us are two incredible student leaders and public speakers. O’Marie Barnes, the student member of the Maryland State Board of Education, and Michelle Fedele, a student leader and public speaker from Anne Arundel County representing MSDE. We have Tracy Kyttle, director of Career Connected Learning. Welcome, everyone. 00;01;15;21 - 00;01;16;23 Tracy Kyttle Hi, Brice. 00;01;16;25 - 00;01;17;20 Brice Thomas Hello. 00;01;17;23 - 00;01;19;27 Michelle Fadele Hi, Brice. Thank you. 00;01;20;00 - 00;01;29;19 Brice Thomas There's no problem. So let's get started. And we're going to start with you Tracy. We just want to set the stage here. What is career connected learning and how does it affect student pathways. 00;01;29;21 - 00;01;31;15 Tracy Kyttle Thank you for this question, Brice. 00;01;31;17 - 00;02;00;20 Tracy Kyttle So Maryland is in the process of completely overhauling the education system and ensuring that every student receives individuals advising that they're building their academic proficiencies needed to be college and career ready to ensure that they are gaining real, industry backed experiences that hold proven labor market value. And so, Maryland designed this career connected learning system that enables us to actually reimagine school itself, 00;02;00;27 - 00;02;38;08 Tracy Kyttle some talking about how we structure school schedules, how we connect students and their learning across all content areas like career and technical education, like the comprehensive arts in math, even in physical education, to real world experiences like internships, apprenticeships, and those industry grade credentials. But it's not just about the experiences themselves. It's also about how we rethink time and how we're creating space, and how we're giving permission for those experiences to happen during the school day. 00;02;38;10 - 00;03;08;18 Tracy Kyttle And then, Bryce, as you noted, at the center of all of that is the voice of our students, right? It's our students telling us what drives them. It's it's our students telling us what brings them to school, what makes them feel like they belong, how they experience learning and how it feels relevant and meaningful. And that's really shaping the design in Maryland of this very large, very interconnected system that is hopefully going to nourish the future town of our state in our country. 00;03;08;21 - 00;03;24;26 Brice Thomas Thanks, Tracy. And when I think of experiences and pathways, I think of journeys. So let's start with you and your personal journey. When you were younger. What did you imagine for yourself and how has that vision changed as you've grown and had new experiences? 00;03;24;29 - 00;03;53;09 O'Marie Barnes Well, my personal story is actually the catalyst for the work that I would go on to do on the state Board of Education. When I was ten years old, I wanted to be a police officer, and when I was studying law enforcement and what law enforcement does, I began to realize that I didn't necessarily want to be a person with a badge, but I wanted to be at the forefront of helping the people who are often unfairly at the forefront of the criminal justice system. 00;03;53;11 - 00;04;19;26 O'Marie Barnes As Horace Mann said famously, that education is the great balance wheel of the social machinery, I thought that by being at the forefront of the programing and the academic policies that impact the millions of students across the country, that I can make a difference in ensuring that the individuals that I was experiencing with were not at the forefront of the criminal justice system. 00;04;19;27 - 00;04;29;06 O'Marie Barnes So I began to uncover this love of policy and law that has really been my North Star for my work on the school board. 00;04;29;08 - 00;04;35;17 Brice Thomas Thank you for that. And what about you, Michelle? Tell us about your journey. 00;04;35;19 - 00;04;57;20 Michelle Fadele Similar to O’Marie I did, as when I was in elementary. I wanted to become an astronaut at first. And then I did my research. I learned what astronauts eat and how the conditions were, and I was like, maybe not for me, maybe not for me. And then over the years, in elementary, I got into student government in middle school, and that's where I got my love from, like student government and just speaking and also just hearing things that are going on. 00;04;57;21 - 00;05;15;26 Michelle Fadele That was the first time I learned that in my middle school, like I might have my own issues, but there's like other issues from different parts around the county and there's like some overlap and also some that are not overlap that school specific. And I believe it's important that students know that there are ways that they can advocate for themselves. 00;05;15;26 - 00;05;28;19 Michelle Fadele Because I started to learn that through the process and still growing to learn that even in high school. So I started off as astronaut. Then I grew up to also having a similar path, wanting to be a lawyer right now. 00;05;28;22 - 00;05;45;14 Brice Thomas That's awesome. That's awesome. The show you mentioned, advocacy and how you've, you know, interacted with so many different students, a wide range of students. So what are you hearing from your peers about why school isn't working for them or where it feels disconnected from their lives? 00;05;45;17 - 00;06;02;18 Michelle Fadele Thank you so much for that question. And I've been really trying to get a lot of student input. I've talked to people in different schools and also put it out on my Instagram. Thank you for reposting. I'm hearing so many different things, but there are similar trends that you can see across the board. First of all, I'm hearing about state testing. 00;06;02;18 - 00;06;24;29 Michelle Fadele There is a big overall consensus from students that they don't like state testing. And it's also interesting coming in my perspective. I have a little sister, a little brother. They agree the same thing, but it's really what's the reasoning? Why do they not like state testing? They don't see the value of connecting it to their own future aspiration or what it's beneficial for them. 00;06;25;05 - 00;06;44;19 Michelle Fadele And I think that's where there's a disconnect between our state board or just education in general, and the students. They're going to ask throughout their whole journey, why is this important? Same thing with math. Why is Pythagorean theorem important to learn? Y equals m plus b. And I think we really need to improve like that connection shift through there. 00;06;44;23 - 00;07;12;11 Michelle Fadele Other things I've heard by this slide as well. Infrastructure. I mean there's like the equity needs for infrastructural building if you don't have a clean space, if you don't have a space that helps support your education, that you can't really grow through that process and also just making it engaging for different student needs. We're in this generation, especially after Covid, we switched to technology, and then we're trying to find this balance on how to meet every student needs as well, with AI jumping into the place. 00;07;12;11 - 00;07;26;28 Michelle Fadele So there's just so much going and whirling around. And I think the biggest things I've heard through is the state testing infrastructure. And also how are we navigating this new learning generation with technology playing in. 00;07;27;01 - 00;07;33;28 Brice Thomas Thank you. Thank you. And, O’Marie, are you hearing similar things from your peers or are there any other issues? 00;07;34;00 - 00;08;01;24 O'Marie Barnes No, certainly Michelle really hit it right on the head. One of the joys of this role is the opportunity to to visit schools across the state and meet with students from a diverse array of communities. But something that I have recognized in my travels is that there really is a university of some of what our students are experiencing, especially when it comes to having autonomy over their own education. 00;08;01;27 - 00;08;23;02 O'Marie Barnes Many of the students that I interact with every day are really looking to have a say. They don't believe that any school personnel should be able to stop them from taking the course of their dreams, if they so choose to want to take that course and opening up those pathways to, as we mentioned, apprenticeships and internships. 00;08;23;05 - 00;08;47;17 O'Marie Barnes And then you also have the introduction of technology, right? How are we going to approach ensuring that the implementation of technology in the classroom is fair and equitable for every single student? And you know, that conversation is going to continue to be at the forefront of education policy in the future, and students are concerned about it. 00;08;47;17 - 00;08;49;29 O'Marie Barnes And that's what I've been hearing consistently. 00;08;50;06 - 00;09;03;13 Brice Thomas Well, thank you. Thank you for that perspective. And so my question goes to Tracy listening to O’Marie and Michelle. How does this tie into the idea that belonging is a primary driver for the educational outcomes the state wants to see? 00;09;03;15 - 00;09;21;13 Tracy Kyttle Absolutely. So one of the things I want to focus on that you mentioned was this idea of sort of students having autonomy over their own education system, and that how do you have the flexibility to enroll in the courses that you want to enroll in that excite you, and that are the reason that you show up to school or that make you feel excited about learning? 00;09;21;16 - 00;09;47;19 Tracy Kyttle And we've known for a really long time in education that belongingness is a key driver of student success. And when students feel valued, when they feel seen, when they feel connected, they're typically more engaged or more likely to attend school. They tend to perform better academically and within school systems. Today, we've found that adults are spending a lot of time talking about our disengaged youth, right? 00;09;47;21 - 00;10;27;21 Tracy Kyttle Those students who are currently absent or who are disconnected, and we sort of deploy in a range of strategies to try to reengage them. And one of the questions that we've been asking ourselves at MSI is how deeply we've really dug into why students show up, don't show up, right. What actually causes disengagement. And one of the things I can say confidently that I've learned after 15 years in school, in schools is that trust is everything right, that students who go on that college trip or have participated in a job shadow, even when they have felt uncomfortable or something is unfamiliar, they didn't do it because of the grade. 00;10;27;21 - 00;10;50;14 Tracy Kyttle They did it because Miss Flores, who they trust, recommended it. Right? The students who say I hate my horticulture class. But when you give me an apprenticeship and I have the opportunity to go climb a tree and be outside and support an arborist, my attendance rate is no longer a question. Because I don't show up for school. I show up because I want my paid experience climbing the tree because that's what I'm enjoying, right? 00;10;50;14 - 00;11;33;19 Tracy Kyttle And so sometimes in education, we focus so much on sort of like programs and initiatives that we almost forget that, that this is, is deeply human centered work, right? That relationships are drivers, that caring and support of adults matter, that trust matters. And that might not necessarily be like the shiniest data point, but it's incredibly powerful. And what Amari spoke to is exactly the spirit of why we're designing the career connected learning system in Maryland the way that we are, because it shifts participation away from eligibility for a program, but instead over to participation based on aspiration. 00;11;33;25 - 00;12;16;23 Tracy Kyttle So students who don't go to high school because they need to work. We have a spot for you, students whose families are concerned about losing public benefits if they're if their child goes to a paid opportunity, we have an opportunity, a space for you to write. We have students who face transportation barriers and within the career connected learning system, we ensure that students feel seen, they feel belong in a system no matter what their circumstances provide, that we are preparing them for a competitive career, that we are meeting them where where they are, so that we can connect them with more caring adults so we can help them. To Michelle's point, find the relevance and 00;12;16;23 - 00;12;46;21 Tracy Kyttle why they're learning what they're learning. And I think there's a really great opportunity as well to look at what are we measuring right? Is there an opportunity for us to look at our school climate and culture surveys to better understand what's actually driving student engagement and attendance? Because, again, usually comes back to a student's access to making connections, as Michelle said, and that access to caring adults and that autonomy. 00;12;46;23 - 00;13;06;19 Brice Thomas Thank you for that, Tracy. And when you when you talk about autonomy, I think back to what Mari and Michelle said, when you know about experiences and changing. And so they were exposed to what it really took to be a part of the career path they were initially interested in, and it changed. I mean, you and I are our ideas are what we wanted to do, have changed. 00;13;06;21 - 00;13;19;01 Brice Thomas And so it requires, you know, a certain amount of agility from our school system. So why is it so important for school systems to remain agile when students inevitably change their minds about their paths? 00;13;19;04 - 00;13;20;01 Tracy Kyttle Yeah. 00;13;20;04 - 00;13;25;23 Tracy Kyttle A dose change their mind, as you said, race, right? Did you did you change your your major in college? 00;13;25;25 - 00;13;30;20 Brice Thomas Change my major in college. Change my whole career path after college. 00;13;30;23 - 00;13;33;11 Tracy Kyttle Likewise. So the average college student. 00;13;33;11 - 00;13;56;27 Tracy Kyttle Changes their major three times. Right. And we heard Omari wanting to be starting starting his career as an officer. We heard Michelle say she wanted to be an astronaut, but they're both interested in a political science at this time, right? And so most of us have had an interest in more than one career. And so it's only fair that we create structural opportunities for young people to, to explore and change their minds. 00;13;56;29 - 00;14;15;26 Tracy Kyttle And I was just in a school today, and we were talking about how often we only figure out what it is that we do love doing by discovering first and experiencing first everything that we don't want to do for, you know? And so I really think it's our job to first in education, ensure that young people know how to be learners. 00;14;15;28 - 00;14;25;10 Tracy Kyttle Do they know how to ask questions? Do they know how to have judgment? Do they have the confidence to raise a hand and say, I don't know, and to have the resilience 00;14;25;10 - 00;14;26;10 Tracy Kyttle to. Actually figure 00;14;26;10 - 00;14;49;15 Tracy Kyttle that part out? And I think if if our young people are going to be competitive in Maryland's economy, right, if they're going to be future ready, if they're going to be the future of our talent pipeline, we can't have school systems that only teach one way of doing math, right. If we don't allow students to choose their own adventure to mix disciplines, you're not going to have creative thinkers. 00;14;49;15 - 00;15;13;13 Tracy Kyttle You won't get your innovators, your problem solvers. You won't have young people who feel empowered to take risks, to connect ideas, to create something that's never existed before. And I think that's really the goal of what Maryland is trying to build, is not to just build for what exists today, what occupations are here now, but for giving them the tools and the freedom to really build what's going to be coming next. 00;15;13;15 - 00;15;34;12 Brice Thomas Thank you. Thank you. And speaking about what's coming next for everyone listening and watching, don't forget to like, comment and subscribe for more Path makers content. Now let's get back to you, Michelle. When you think about bridging the disconnect for students in school, what kinds of real world experiences would make school feel more meaningful, relevant, or worth students time? 00;15;34;14 - 00;15;57;09 Michelle Fadele I think what we've already been discussing, just that hands on experience the internships, the CTE programs. I'm currently a student and I do an apprenticeship here at the Board of Education. I like to get hands on and apply what I've been learning throughout my high school journey into something like this. Right now, I know in different programs trade school, like if not college, you can go to trade school. 00;15;57;09 - 00;16;20;21 Michelle Fadele I know my brother has already received certification in like mechanical stuff. So opening those pathways, I think once students get those opportunities instead of like waiting until after high school in granting that into the high school experience that already gets them excited for what's up next. And I already see that the students, like Miss Kyttle, was saying about the students who might not like learning. 00;16;20;22 - 00;16;38;15 Michelle Fadele Like when you put them out there, then they love it. I see students who usually are out in the hallways in schools, but when they got into our Cat North program here in an Arundel County, like they're locked in because this is something they enjoy doing, this is something they want to see themselves in. And it's so it's so fascinating, so amazing. 00;16;38;15 - 00;17;01;15 Michelle Fadele Because truly everyone has an eagerness to learn, but it's really putting them in the right environment for it. And when you see them in the right environment, it's just so beautifully, they beautifully flourish and everyone has that capacity. So I think having those opportunities and expanding our CCL program really encourages students to learn more and to go forward. 00;17;01;17 - 00;17;05;15 Brice Thomas Yeah, I love that. And what about you, O’Marie? 00;17;05;17 - 00;17;42;25 O'Marie Barnes Just everything that has been said. This is incredible. The elements of our communities are not going to begin in high school. They often have their roots when students are matriculating through K through 12 education elementary school. And so our solutions, including the discussion about what you want to do in the future and what gets your heart beating, have to also start during that early time and so, so consequential in your life. 00;17;42;28 - 00;18;11;04 O'Marie Barnes And that is why what the state of Maryland is doing as we embark on this journey of creating this career connected learning system. As Tracy mentioned with the six year plans, college counseling so that middle schoolers can begin in the sixth grade to chart an actionable plan for the coursework that they want to take in high school, and the post-secondary track that they would like to pursue 00;18;11;07 - 00;18;47;11 O'Marie Barnes and building off of that. How can we ensure that we have a real world applicable curriculum as well? What does that look like for a student like me, who's not necessarily a math guy? But I'm interested in going into public service or running for an elected office. How about not necessarily algebra, but data statistics and modeling, right? How can we ensure that whatever track you want to go into, there is a a course in across all disciplines that is directly applicable to your career path. 00;18;47;11 - 00;19;09;15 O'Marie Barnes And that's how we can ensure that I'm not just doing math, but I'm doing something. I'm doing math that is actually related to this great passion that I have. And so those those two concepts are sisters in this work. We have to start early, and we have to make sure that students have a real world applicable curriculum. 00;19;09;18 - 00;19;25;16 Brice Thomas Yeah, yeah. And I agree with you that this is an amazing conversation. And so, Tracy, how does career connected learning provide the agile environment where students can see that connection, that connection between their math content and actual career solutions, for instance? 00;19;25;18 - 00;19;26;18 Tracy Kyttle Yeah, I would encourage. 00;19;26;18 - 00;20;00;00 Tracy Kyttle More and Michelle to jump in here to with examples as I kind of chat through this, because I believe if I'm if I'm not mistaken, you attend both, you're both in AP classes, but you also tend to CTE school. Right. And I think that's really special. Michelle, your apprenticeship is connected to a service learning opportunity. Right. And so one of the things we're trying to do in Maryland through the CCL system Career Connected learning system, is to ensure that students can be both and that we're not siloed them into any particular type of experience or pathway. 00;20;00;03 - 00;20;30;16 Tracy Kyttle One of the biggest changes throughout Maryland's transformation that I had mentioned earlier that were currently enduring and planning for, is pioneering across the country a new structure for mathematics. So, Bryce, I think you asked specifically about mathematics. Historically, math in this country has been geared towards ensuring every single student is calculus ready. And that begins with a sequence of algebra one, geometry, algebra two, and the state of Maryland. 00;20;30;17 - 00;20;31;16 Tracy Kyttle This is not my work. 00;20;31;16 - 00;20;32;14 Tracy Kyttle It is the work of. 00;20;32;14 - 00;20;57;19 Tracy Kyttle Doctor Lindsay and our team at St, who is looking at what it would look like to have an integrated algebra sequence where students take integrated algebra one and two, and then they can flex into a series of of mathematics courses to marry your point. Statistics and probability is one of those data science. They can continue with that that calculus route. 00;20;57;21 - 00;21;10;04 Tracy Kyttle But there's a few options. And our CTE programs are modeling that as well through what we call the core flex model. So a student can participate in earning their mechanical. 00;21;10;04 - 00;21;10;23 Tracy Kyttle So Michelle. You 00;21;10;23 - 00;21;20;00 Tracy Kyttle spoke about auto mechanics or a mechanical certification. A student can earn that certification by taking auto one, two, three, and four 00;21;20;02 - 00;21;20;21 Tracy Kyttle through 00;21;20;24 - 00;21;49;00 Tracy Kyttle through a course sequence. Or a student could also take auto one and two, and then take dual enrollment classes and get their ASC certification through the community college. Or they could get an apprenticeship and take auto one and two at their home school and then flex into an apprenticeship experience. And so what that does is it doesn't does it doesn't just change where our students are learning, but it changes who is teaching them and how they're learning. 00;21;49;02 - 00;22;28;06 Tracy Kyttle It allows school systems to broaden the number of students who can, who can fulfill their aspiration. Because sometimes students get turned away from CTE schools because there's not enough seats or sections or enough teachers. And so what are CCL system is doing? Is reimagining time, reimagining space, reimagining. Who is teaching a similar standard that is all sort of reaching this, this North star of, of this industry recognized credential or another pathway that is leading them to a high wage, proven industry grade experience. 00;22;28;08 - 00;22;56;08 Tracy Kyttle And so we are really excited about the way that our comprehensive arts team has has identified 25 different state approved industry credentials that their students can earn. We have our physical education team who is applying for coaching licenses for our young people. So every content area across the state Department of Education in Maryland is helping coaches. Student can be both in AP and in CTE. 00;22;56;11 - 00;23;22;07 Tracy Kyttle They can both be loving physical education because that's why they show up to school and have an experience coaching and then leave with the coaching license. And so we're getting really creative about not pigeonholing students into specific predetermined for core sequences. And then as, as, as we've been saying, kind of allowing students to choose their own adventure. What that also solves for is barriers for transient students. 00;23;22;10 - 00;23;40;21 Tracy Kyttle So if you have a student who who lives in Prince George's County and transfers to Anne Arundel County, they might not have the same CTE programs. So what happens then in education is the conversation changes from what is the student's aspiration to what do I need to get this student to graduate? And that's not why we're doing this work, right. 00;23;40;24 - 00;24;03;09 Tracy Kyttle We're doing this work to serve students and helping them achieve their goals. And so we are removing some of the structural barriers that we have adults have created for ourselves and allowing our students to really be those drivers, as Amari had said, and have that autonomy to pick and choose and blend and match what they want in order to achieve their career goal. 00;24;03;12 - 00;24;04;01 Brice Thomas Thank you for that. 00;24;04;02 - 00;24;04;28 O'Marie Barnes And I would. 00;24;05;01 - 00;24;06;01 Brice Thomas Go ahead. 00;24;06;03 - 00;24;31;06 O'Marie Barnes Yes, I would love to just hop in here and double tap on thinking Lindsay and her team, as well as the board leadership on the development of this core flex model. As Tracy mentioned, I am a CTE student. I'm a probably Six Sigma certified CTE student because my business Administration course, but I also take AP calculus as well. 00;24;31;08 - 00;25;02;18 O'Marie Barnes And so both is really the way forward. It's about all of the above approach to public education and also accessibility as well. A few months ago, I had the pleasure of speaking at a Prince George's County Public Schools press conference on dual in schools, where they are bringing college level coursework, dual enrollment courses to Prince George's County public school campuses in partnership with Prince George's Community College. 00;25;02;20 - 00;25;23;18 O'Marie Barnes And that, for example, another example of accessibility of autonomy, students who have transportation difficulties, as you mentioned, Tracy, will now have the opportunity to be taught the same material in their classrooms by certified educators. And so just I applaud the entire team over at MSDE for the work that is being done. 00;25;23;21 - 00;25;51;08 Brice Thomas That is so well said, and it seems that the running themes are autonomy and options and choice. And so Amari, while you're while your mic is still hot, students can sometimes say that they feel that they have been chosen rather than being the chooser. How important is it for you and your peers to be the authors of your own trajectory, and have the map to explore what you do and don't want to do? 00;25;51;10 - 00;26;19;19 O'Marie Barnes It is so very important, and that's why the development of the six year plan starting in middle school are really integral part of the creation of this this career connected learning system. And I would also say interpersonal relationships with your school counselors as well. Going to be a really important part of this effort. How are the college counselors starting in middle school and the career counselors working together? 00;26;19;19 - 00;26;44;12 O'Marie Barnes How can we promote that cooperation so that the plans that are being written are being followed? Once students move into into high school. So it is everything has to work together. There are different pieces, but we have to make sure they're moving together and and all to the benefit of the student with their voice at the center of it. 00;26;44;14 - 00;26;47;01 Brice Thomas Thank you, thank you. And what are your thoughts, Michelle? 00;26;47;08 - 00;27;09;08 Michelle Fadele Yes, I was just I'm just, like, listening and taking all memories, right? I'm like, oh my gosh, so many things. Beautifully said. And I think he also touched upon something just important is like creating that accessibility. I've seen different and I believe different counties do it. And it's amazing. Sometimes when you have college classes, sometimes a professor is teaching at your own high school and you have these like things offered or you have it online and virtual. 00;27;09;08 - 00;27;32;17 Michelle Fadele I remember taking like virtual classes and getting like credits for community college. Like, this is amazing. Like trying to close that barrier and gap of accessibility. So important and just continuing with all the different ways. And I think someone else mentioned it, not keeping it in one way, not just like, oh, we're only focusing on CTE programs or only focus on AP or only focus on college credits. 00;27;32;17 - 00;27;55;26 Michelle Fadele We're really trying to give that option for students. And like Amari said, autonomy, giving them the student choice and where they can go to flex. And something that also came up this week. So when asked me a question, is actually when I was with Miss Tracy in the program is like, Michelle, you wanted to become a lawyer, but you also took some high school courses that didn't actually really like fully in line. 00;27;55;26 - 00;28;21;20 Michelle Fadele I also like public speaking, so I like doing morning announcements and broadcasting. And the question if the six year plan would still be able to like, implement that interest, if people have, you know, other interests with that. And I believe the question was answered that they are allowed to do that. And I think it's important not just to have the one way tunnel like, oh, I want to become this, but having the opportunities to also find out different things that you like or enjoy. 00;28;21;20 - 00;28;44;17 Michelle Fadele And you also see that overlap. I do broadcasting, I like that that also goes with public speaking to help me with the lawyer. Sometimes it overlap and sometimes it doesn't, which is perfectly okay, but I think the perfect thing is having the options and choices. And it's just like ice cream. You have so many different flavors and get to choose how you want to scoop it and put it together to make it one beautiful, 00;28;44;20 - 00;28;46;21 Michelle Fadele you know? Ice cream treat? 00;28;46;23 - 00;29;10;08 Brice Thomas Absolutely. Not only am I hungry, but I'm also thinking about the fact that you said you're, you know, taking these broadcasting courses and you're doing a podcast right now, right? So there's that connection. But Tracy can tell you that the industry changes rapidly. So, Tracy, how is MSDE preparing students for broad occupations rather than specific jobs that might not even exist in the labor market 6 or 7 years from now? 00;29;10;12 - 00;29;24;25 Tracy Kyttle Yes. Michelle, I'm I think your ice cream analogy is going to come with me wherever I go. That was wonderful. Yes, I love cheese. Your own adventure and scoop of ice cream. So 00;29;24;28 - 00;29;47;20 Tracy Kyttle we. As O’Marie Had spoken to, we in Maryland are developing some strategic six year plans that evolve with students beginning in middle school. And so I also want to note that while we're talking a lot about MSDE, this work isn't there is work that is very specific to a state Department of Education. And then there's also work that is Maryland Blueprint. 00;29;47;21 - 00;30;10;27 Tracy Kyttle This is Maryland's strategic plan, not just MSDE. And one of the that we have when we're sitting with the governor's office or we're sitting with our Department of Labor, is you have young people in eighth grade who are aspiring for jobs that don't yet exist. When we sit down with our governor's Workforce Development Board, we have conversations about the importance of translating credentials or credentials in AI. 00;30;11;00 - 00;30;32;21 Tracy Kyttle But the industry has an evolved yet enough for us to be able to have like a national license and licensing entity that is going to verify that that credential has labor market value. So really at the forefront of doing this work across the entire state. I think when we're talking about students specifically, we are measuring their aspirations. 00;30;32;27 - 00;31;06;12 Tracy Kyttle We are matching experiences, activities and experiences. So in Maryland we separate activities from experiences. Activities would be those kind of quick hit mock interviews, job shadows, a field trip from those experiences, which are those 250, 450, our apprenticeship experiences that are really deep rooted. We are doing a lot of connections to Michelle's point about how are we ensuring there's relevance within every single classroom 00;31;06;15 - 00;31;28;02 Tracy Kyttle as well. So, for example, when I talk to our history team, they'll say, a lot of the students want to be lawyers or go into political science, but all the experiences are in museums. So that then gives us the opportunity to say, did you know that Howard County's government is currently offering apprenticeships paid at $21 an hour to students who would like to apply? 00;31;28;04 - 00;31;56;06 Tracy Kyttle Right. And so we get to make this connection across all contents, because our arts team, our team, like they are our social studies team, they also want to see young people grow into a field that they love. And so there's conversations both at the state level as well as within schools about the way that that metabolizes. I also think some people don't realize that young people are often the first to know about emerging industries, right? 00;31;56;07 - 00;32;19;08 Tracy Kyttle Especially in tech. And so then we as adults get to sit down and say, okay, we see AI is coming in. AI literacy is important. What is an industry credential look like? What is the field going to be doing with that? Is our Department of Commerce giving grant funding in order to incentivize individuals who want to go into that field. 00;32;19;11 - 00;32;49;07 Tracy Kyttle And so it's it's a state education agency's role to prepare the young people as often as possible. But then we work as as a cohesive whole in the state of Maryland. How are our higher ed teams receive this information when transcripts no longer, say, algebra one, algebra two? In geometry, how will they allow stackable credentials for that young sibling who is doing mechanical and then continuing their education at the college? 00;32;49;12 - 00;33;03;27 Tracy Kyttle And so we, the whole state of Maryland, are preparing our young people by just having really engaging, rich and courageous conversations about it. Look what it looks like, not just to prepare the senior, but to prepare the eighth grader to. 00;33;03;29 - 00;33;20;25 Brice Thomas Thank you. Thank you for that. That is very well said. Unfortunately, we're getting close to time. But before we go, I want to pose this final question to both of our students. What do you wish adults, especially those designing the education system, better understood about students today? 00;33;21;01 - 00;33;48;24 O'Marie Barnes I would say students are are the way that they think about their career. Is is in a way fundamentally is definitely changed. But it may be fundamentally and feel free to disagree fundamentally different than it was, say, 50 years ago. The tradition 50 years ago, the traditional notion was that you would find a career and you would stay with that career. 00;33;48;24 - 00;34;21;29 O'Marie Barnes You would stay with the occupation for the majority of your life. You would retire, you know, have your retirement benefits. But the way that the peers that I'm speaking with every single day, I think about their career, they don't want to be stuck in one space. They want to move around. They couldn't see themselves working the same job for decades upon decades upon decades, and especially with all of these new emerging industries. 00;34;22;02 - 00;35;01;24 O'Marie Barnes I think adults who are designing these education systems have to be willing to, to not only accept that, but to embrace that. How can we educate a generation that will be able to succeed in any room that they walk into? And that is why the conversation about autonomy, about fluidity, about a real world applicable curriculum is so important because the probability that a student is going to stay in one career for decades is dropping as we speak, because mindsets are changing. 00;35;01;26 - 00;35;06;18 O'Marie Barnes And so that's what I would I would say I hope they would understand. 00;35;06;20 - 00;35;07;07 Brice Thomas Thank you. 00;35;07;12 - 00;35;29;06 Michelle Fadele Thank you. I would also like to add on it's really and the question always funds rise. Like how do you measure student success. How do you measure student success. And like I said, it changes over time. Like what it was with the years ago. It changes now. And I think it's each about each student's individuality. But how can you make that need? 00;35;29;07 - 00;35;46;13 Michelle Fadele Like it's not really equality that you can say, I give everyone the same set of resources, the same set of books, and everyone's going to succeed. No, it's really about the equity. Looking at each student's and seeing what do they need, what do they want to get, and what are the things that I can implement. Me and my brother are two different people. 00;35;46;14 - 00;36;07;11 Michelle Fadele I'm outgoing. I want to become a lawyer. He's a sport athlete. He wants to do mechanical stuff. We have two different pathways, but we also need the education system within us. So there are things that are similar, but also things that are yet different, which I think the six year plan really does own in on and helping students as early as middle school, which is amazing. 00;36;07;13 - 00;36;34;09 Michelle Fadele And when I think about middle school, I'm thinking about my seventh grade sister. I'm like, this is going to be so amazing for especially someone she doesn't know where she wants to go, but at least having that exploration phase and are you starting to think about it would help her already set her to succeed. So again, I would say for the adults it really is what the student success looked like, but not for them to answer, but for them to reach out to students to give that input. 00;36;34;11 - 00;37;01;22 Brice Thomas I have to say I introduce you guys as incredible, but I don't feel like that is the correct adjective for you. Phenomenal. Maybe brilliant, I don't know, but we we thank you for your insights. Now, Tracy, the Division of College and Career Pathways mission is guided by five North Star core values via belonging, career relevance, innovation, excellence and collaboration. 00;37;01;24 - 00;37;04;22 Brice Thomas Which of these core values alliance most closely with your work? 00;37;04;23 - 00;37;14;17 Tracy Kyttle So if I can use Michelle's. Analogy around the ice cream, I think I have, you know, we have all of them, but I think that my flavor of the year will probably be 00;37;14;18 - 00;37;40;12 Tracy Kyttle career relevance and collaboration to many of the things that I already had mentioned, just around the connection with partnership through our other state agencies, our partnership with every other content area across our education system. I think Marilyn's CCL system really challenges people to collaborate in ways they haven't always. I think sometimes when I go to conferences, people say, how do you get your Department of Labor to connect with you? 00;37;40;14 - 00;38;14;16 Tracy Kyttle Right? And we get to talk through what does that strategy and partnership look like? Everything from our special education team, right, to make sure that our students who are receiving transition services also know that they have very clear, career connected experiences as well that are available to them. And connecting with that system, everything from ensuring that when we put out guidance, that the capstone guidance for our advanced academics team looks and smells very similar to the rigor of the capstone that comes out from the comprehensive arts team that comes out from the CTE team. 00;38;14;18 - 00;38;41;01 Tracy Kyttle And so it makes just making sure we're showing up with one voice in all spaces. The other thing I would just echo is for our industry partners, our industry partners, if O’Marie and Michelle are not convincing enough here, young people are amazing and they are innovative. And if you are looking for a way to elevate your your business like our young people are the people to do it. 00;38;41;01 - 00;39;12;11 Tracy Kyttle And I think sometimes folks think that young people sometimes are liabilities, but they're actually enormous assets. And I think they're at the forefront of so much. And so I would just really encourage our industry to not just see that talent and invest in that talent. But one of the things that we've been really committed to with the CCL system is ensuring that our business and industry partners are actually shaping the knowledge and the skills that our young people need to know and be able to do and demonstrate before they leave high school. 00;39;12;12 - 00;39;31;09 Tracy Kyttle And so historically, it was educators who would write a kind of a program of study, and they would say the learning outcomes are this, this and this. And if they meet those things, then they are ready, college and career ready. What we're doing is we're saying is that now within Maryland CCL system, every young person needs to have a work plan. 00;39;31;12 - 00;40;00;23 Tracy Kyttle They need to have a real employer evaluations, performance evaluations. And so what that then enables us to do is ensure that no employer or no industry is saying that, that your students are not ready because they actually authored the skills and the knowledge and the competencies that they want that person to lead with. And so it allows us to really braid and to be strategic about not just building the student's skill set and making sure the student knows that very much. 00;40;00;25 - 00;40;23;10 Tracy Kyttle What they're doing is relevant to the employer, but also gives the employer a safety net. And knowing that the student is leaving with the skill set that they're seeking. And so that's a little bit of a pivot. And it does require a lot of collaboration in a way that hasn't always existed. So I would say career relevance with the six year plans, with the way we engage our industry partners with the work across the state. 00;40;23;11 - 00;40;26;29 Tracy Kyttle And then of course, that collaboration piece. 00;40;27;02 - 00;40;50;07 Brice Thomas So it's a very large and tasty ice cream cone, I'll tell you that. But thank you, Tracy, O’Marie and Michelle for sharing your stories and your insights today. We really appreciate it. And you have created such a deep well of thought for us all and for everyone else. Don't forget to like, comment and subscribe to get more path makers content. 00;40;50;09 - 00;40;57;14 Chuck Wallance Guest views on path makers are their own and do not necessarily reflect the official position of the Maryland State Department of Education.